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This episode was produced by James Chua and Ashley Tam, hosted by James Chua, and graphic by Callista Wu and Claire Sun.
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction to White Coats & Rice: An APAMSA Podcast
00:26 Introduction to Ashley Tam
03:28 Baking Cantonese Pastries and Buns
07:41 Playing Genshin Impact
11:26 The Journey to Medicine
14:31 Choosing Pathology as a Specialty
22:24 Clinical Skills in Pathology?
24:50 Why Did You Join APAMSA?
31:05 APAMSA Core Memory
33:21 2023 National Conference Theme
35:07 Wishes for APAMSA’s Future
37:18 Community Impact Week 2025
39:16 What Are You Looking Forward to in Your Medical Career?
41:46 This or That? Questions
45:14 Advice for Pre-Health and Medical Students
00:00 Introduction to White Coats & Rice: An APAMSA Podcast
James: Welcome everyone to the third episode of the Asian Pacific American Medical Student Association Podcast, from roundtable discussions of current health topics to recaps of our panels with distinguished leaders in the healthcare field, to even meeting current student leaders within the organization, this is White Coats and Rice. My name is James Chua, second year medical student at Touro University, Nevada, and the current Fundraising Director at APAMSA, and I’ll be your host for today.
00:26 Introduction to Ashley Tam
James: On today’s episode, we are thrilled to welcome Ashley Tam, an alumnus of Cornell University and current fourth-year medical student at Oregon Health and Science University. Hailing from Oregon, Ashley’s path to medicine is truly inspiring. As the daughter of Chinese immigrants, her upbringing was deeply influenced by the richness of Chinese culture and traditions. However, it wasn’t until her time at Cornell that she fully recognized the importance of her cultural identity and what it plays in her life. In 2020 she began her medical education at OHSU and by her second year, Ashley and her local APAMSA chapter hosted the National Conference at their school themed: Renewal: Out of the Flames, Into the Future. Ashley has worn many hats within APAMSA from National Conference Director to Co-Social Media Director, and now, Communications Vice President. Her dedication to the organization highlights her passion for amplifying AANHPI voices and fostering meaningful connections within the community. Beyond medicine, Ashley’s interests are as vibrant as her professional achievements. Whether exploring Teyvat and Genshin Impact where she boasts over 1300 days of active gameplay, watching anime, or being a proud dog mom to Goji, her spirited Shiba Inu, Ashley embraces life with enthusiasm. Without further ado, join us as we dive into Ashley’s journey, her unique perspectives on medicine, and the vibrant passions that shape her world. Ashley, welcome to the show. How are you doing today?
Ashley: I’m doing good. Thank you so much. That was a beautiful introduction. I love that.
James: Yeah, I said this in Vic’s as well, but a lot of the stuff is drawn from previous APAMSA bios, so if you don’t recognize that, then you know from I think 20–, year first National Conference.
Ashley: Yeah, that is triggering some memories for sure of like typing that up and submitting it.
James: Yeah, I remember for me, since this is my first year on the National Board, I had no idea what to write for my bio. And I think the example that was given was like, one, written in third person, two, it was very long, and so I was like, oh perfect, let me do something very similar. And then I took the time to read everybody else’s bios, and I was like, hmm, no one else took this approach.
Ashley: Yeah, I– like as Comms VP this year, I definitely go through, you know, everyone’s submissions when they submit their bios, because we need to get that prepared for our website and everything. And it’s really interesting to see the different approaches people have, like some people super, super long and some people like don’t include their hobbies and I reach out to them and I’m like ‘Hey, like what are some fun things you do outside of school?’ Um, so it’s fun to see people’s interpretations of you know, the prompt.
03:28 Baking Cantonese Pastries and Buns
James: Yeah, absolutely. And speaking of hobbies, one thing that I did want the listeners to learn about you personally is that I remember when we were talking about or like preparing for the podcast, one of the things you mentioned is that you are a baker.
Ashley: Oh yeah. I mean, I’m not like an expert or anything like that.
James: Well in that case what do you think is your favorite thing to bake?
Ashley: Hm. I think, similar to a lot of people, it’s like my baking journey kind of started around the height of COVID because I was like at home. I had a scribing job, but you know, at that time, they were like, you should probably not come in. And so I was at home, my family’s at home, my sister is doing school from home and I’m like I have nothing to do right now because I’m basically waiting for med school to start. and I decided to bake because I don’t like cooking as much because I’m more of a recipes person, and I feel like baking sort of like scratches that itch for me because it’s like a little bit more scientific. You really need to measure things out. And so because we weren’t going out to buy things as much, I decided to make egg tarts. And like I went through like a couple iterations. I mean, not my own recipe, this is other peoples’ recipes. But like the way that I did the recipe, I feel like I messed up a couple times and it didn’t turn out the way I wanted to, but then I really got into baking egg tarts during COVID. Then I pineapple buns as well, and then like the Cantonese cocktail buns which are the like still a milk bread bun but then the inside has like a coconut filling. So I made that sort of in rotation for my family. I’m like, oh, our stock is running low so I’m going to make some more. ‘Cause also I’m a little bit bored so I’m just like keeping up our stock and everyone gained weight over that time because I was baking so prolifically. But those are my favorite things to bake because I never thought that I would, you know, be able to make that at home. It’s always something that we have to go out to the Cantonese bakeries to buy. So it was really cool to be able to sort of provide that for my family at that time.
James: Absolutely. And I think like, for me personally, I’ve always also and I feel like this is applicable to many people in the science field how they prefer the science of baking to just cooking which I do both but I feel like cooking is a lot more about vibes than anything else. But yeah, when I was reading your description about like all the things you’ve made before, the three items you wanted to highlight. I actually last night and now that I’m finally on winter break. I finally have had the time to do the things that I’ve wanted to do. And one of those things on the top of my list, because when you’re a busy medical student, all you can really focus on is studying, right? One of the things on the top of my list was baking. And so the thing that I made most recently were Bolo Bao inspired. They were inspired cookies though. So it had like the topping of the bolo that makes it look like a pineapple. I guess. Or I…
Ashley: Yeah! Yeah, yeah. That’s awesome. Was it successful?
James: I’ll show you a picture and you can be the judge. Um, yeah, it, the base of the cookie was this like brown butter experience. So it was just like, it tasted just like a normal cookie. And so I’m like, now I’m actually right after this about to go to Dim Sum with friends. So I was gonna try like- gonna try like an actual pineapple bun and be like ‘how does actually compare?’
Ashley: Yeah. That’s awesome. You should, um when you go you should get the custard filled one. That’s always a fun one.
07:41 Playing Genshin Impact
James: Yeah, and so on a separate note though, something that I wanted to ask more about. So, over 1300 days of Genshin Impact. That’s, for the listeners, I think over four years if the math translates.
Ashley: It is, yeah.
James: How did that start?
Ashley: That’s a… that’s a great question. I think the launch of the game started, it was in like October 2020. I sort of had my eye on it, but you know, I was in my first year of medical school, I was doing didactics. And I was like, well, I don’t think I have time to like commit to starting a new game. I never played any like Gacha games before, but it just like really interested me. And then, it wasn’t until I think February when we finished one of our blocks we had just taken finals and we had a week off afterwards. And I was like oh, maybe I’m ready now, to like start this game and we’ll see how it goes. And you know, I think I started playing around February of 2021 and like the rest is history. Like, I’ve really liked it when I first started and because I had that week long break I was playing it like a lot and so I got really invested in it when I first started. And then, uh, Genshin is just one of those games where, you know, if you want to be free-to-play you kind of have to invest the time to be able to get the characters that you want and to be able to progress through the game easier, and so ya, because I really liked it I was okay investing that time. And it was like fun to you know, “I have to do dailies, I have to do my weeklies” and then it just becomes part of my list of things to do, not in a bad way. But it’s like, fun to keep up and to be able to feel like I can look forward to the next update and feel like prepared for like the new characters that are going to drop. Like I’ve come very far. And I’m proud of it to some extent. I haven’t spent money on it– my own money. I have had friends who have given me some like a birthday gift or like a Christmas gift. Like here’s like an Apple gift card and like I appreciate it but I haven’t spent my own money so I feel a little bit proud of that.
James: I feel that. Yeah. I used to play Genshin Impact and I also took pride in the fact that I was also a free-to-play player. But then like, eventually it got to the point where I did not get the 5– I lost my 50/50.
Ashley: Ugh, the worst. I think I have, on the poor side of luck with Gacha pulls. It’s like, a little bit upsetting sometimes. But it is how it is, so like I ration my Primos a lot. So I’m like, “I’m going to like hold out and like skip this character” because I know there’s another character that I will want later. I feel like I have relatively good Primo management. And yah. It’s a lot of I guess, self control.
11:26 The Journey to Medicine
James: Yeah. Absolutely. And see the reason why I want to bring up these hobbies and I do this with all of our guests. It’s to sort of show how like, medical students are not simply just, we’re not glued to our textbooks at all times. We are people, we do take care of ourselves in all shapes or forms, whether it’s like baking like you do, gaming like you do, or traveling, like whatever it is that keeps you grounded, you know. And so, I think I’m now very interested, I think our listeners would love to know, how has your journey been to medicine? Like, where did it begin? How did it get to OHSU? Like wherever you want to start personally.
Ashley: Ooh, I think my mom like pulled this out of the storage closet really recently but in first grade there’s like this art thing that our teacher had us do. And it’s like a picture of us and like ‘when I grow up I want to be’, and I had written doctor. So I guess like that’s when it started. Why did I wanna be a doctor at that time? I have no idea. I don’t know who put that idea my head. Is it because I grew up in like, an immigrant Chinese family and, you know, the classics careers that they love their kids to have, it’s like a doctor or lawyer. Something cool like that. I don’t know. But I think when I decided that I really wanted to pursue medicine was just through science classes and being really interested in the human body and like anatomy and like how everything functions about anatomy and physiology was super cool because you’re like wow it makes like total sense like how this works in the body and then it triggers this. And then it’s just like the science of it just makes so much sense, like the logic, and I thought that was really cool. So I think I decided at that time that I really wanted to pursue a career in the human sciences. Um, and I think I always sort of had an interest also in like the molecular side of things, like similarly how the logic of the human body is super cool. Like, I thought the logic and processes of like cells on a molecular level is also super cool. And so I think that’s sort of what, that was like the foundation for me finding interest in pathology because pathology is kind of like a specialty that is very granular and you have to look at like – you know number one it’s very small you’re literally looking under a microscope but there’s a lot of details that go on in pathology. And my love for that probably stems from my love for like details of molecular biology and stuff like that.
14:31 Choosing Pathology as a Specialty
James: Absolutely. And I actually, it’s interesting, because I would love to learn more about your journey to pathology because as far as I’m aware, you did, it was last year I think? The pathology fellowship, right?
Ashley: Yes, yes.
James: Yeah. So for me personally, like, I was actually very interested in pathology. There were only two specialties that I really, like, were leaning towards when I started medical school, leading up to medical school. One was psychiatry and then the other was pathology. And so…
Ashley: Super different!
James: Very, extremely different. And I think, like, my interest in pathology, stemmed from like, I did a post-bac, they taught it so well there. I also worked in so many research labs and I like that setting, right? Yeah. But then by the time I actually started medical school, I found that the way they approached pathology at my own personal institution made me like lose my spark for it.
Ashley: Oh no!
James: But, it’s fine! I was also in cadaver lab and I realized I didn’t want to do like forensic pathology.
Ashley: Yeah that’s fair.
James: Yeah but maybe you can re-inspire me so could you please tell me and also our viewers more about your junior pathology, post-junior pathology fellowship and how that really – I’m guessing it really affirmed like what you wanted to do.
Ashley: Yeah. I think I came to my decision of specialty a little easier than other students in general, not specifically like just in pathology, but I had exposure to pathology in undergrad actually because I did some shadowing. And like you I had been in some research labs before and I thought like bench work was really cool. And I was thinking, oh, I know what a research lab looks like, what that setting is, like the bench work but I don’t know what goes on in hospital lab and then so I did like some Google searching and I was like, oh pathology, that’s something that exists. And then there’s pathologists that like run the lab, whatever that means. And so I ended up shadowing some pathologists at a hospital that was close to my undergrad campus. And I thought what did was super cool. At that time when I was shadowing I basically sat at the scope with them and they walked me through how they were looking at cases and making diagnoses. Like “oh, this is what I’m seeing on the slide or under the scope”. And they’re showing me like what all the different cells were what all the architecture was, and it was hard to follow along because I didn’t have a lot of histology background, like at all. But I just thought it was cool how they could look at something and make a diagnosis off of it. And that you can actually see what disease looks like under the scope. And then they also use a lot of other tests like there are stains and stuff. And I just thought that, that logic puzzle was super cool because they’re like “okay so if you know this stain is positive and this stain is negative then I can say like it’s probably this diagnosis”. And I thought that was the coolest thing. And so I already had this. I was already like, inspired by pathology coming into med school. And so, you know, as a good med student, I tried to like, keep all the doors open and keep my mind open to everything that medicine had to offer. At my school I feel like when we had pathology lectures. When the pathologists came and gave us lectures, I was like super inspired by them because they were like super happy it seemed like they really liked what they were doing and they really liked the things that they were teaching. So that was a big plus. I mean, I already have like positive vibes about pathology but interacting with those pathologists I’m like “wow they’re super happy and super excited about what they do”. And eventually, I learned that there was this post-junior or sometimes post-sophomore pathology fellowship at OHSU. And there are, a handful of schools across the country that offer programs like this. But it’s like a completely optional thing, it’s not something you have to do if you want to pursue a pathology residency. There are plenty of people who don’t do that. And then, there are people who do a year in pathology but they go into other specialties. But it’s like, you know, maybe they have an interest in pathology, or they feel like they wanted to take more time to sort of think about what specialty they actually want to apply into and stuff like that. So people have a lot of reasons for doing it. I personally wanted to do it because I had heard from other people that it’s hard to get exposure to what the life of a pathologist is in med school because you know, it’s not a required rotation, there’s not that many elective rotations available to explore pathology and the fact that it’s just so different from the workflow of any of the other specialties. You can’t really get a sense of, a similar sense of what pathology is on a different rotation. So, and I was okay with adding another year, I know that can be a barrier, but I was like, you know what, I think I want to do this because I really want to know what pathology is all about. So I ended up doing that between my third and fourth year of school. And it was awesome because I– because it was between my third and fourth year of school, I had already finished all of my third year core rotations before starting. And so I had already gotten exposure to, you know, generally a lot of other specialties. And then that first month of orientation of my post-junior fellowship, I was like learning how to gross, I was learning how to use a microscope, learning how to write a report. And even in that first month when I wasn’t like really doing anything real. I was like sort of clumsily like trying to figure out like how to be a pathologist. That first month like sealed the deal for me. I was like, I’m definitely going to pathology. This is like so much more fun. I’m like coming away from those days so much more excited. I’m coming home like really wanting to tell my husband like what I did that day. And I felt so good about pathology, like all the other doors are for sure closed at this point. And then the rest of the year was just like super fun because I got to really just like learn what I wanted to do as like my future career. And I think the program was really cool because you essentially get to work like a PGY1 pathology resident. So you’re really integrated into the residents’ schedule, like you staff a service by yourself and sign out one-on-one with an attending. You’re not reporting to your other residents, you’re part of the team. And so it was, it was a really fun experience for sure. And it solidified my love for pathology and it also helped me learn so, so, so much.
22:24 Clinical Skills in Pathology?
James: Absolutely. I’m very interested to hear your thoughts, so one of the things that like, people really brought this up to me. And I feel like it also I feel like it applies to psych or psychiatry in that like, it’s sort of unfortunate that all of the clinical skills like the actual clinical skills like how to listen to heart sounds, it’s sort of like you don’t use it as much in pathology. So I’d love to know what are your thoughts on that?
Ashley: Of like learning clinical skills that I won’t use like as a pathologist?
James: Yeah!
Ashley: Um, I mean, I guess that’s just like the game of med school. Is like, doing a lot of things. or like learning a lot of things that you might not use but are important to explore all that medicine has to offer. I guess it’s just like, you know, a means to an end. So, I guess I never really thought about like “oh there’s all these things that I learned but then like I won’t use it. So I will probably lose the skill later on in life”. Um, but I feel like that’s just the nature of med school and like without having learned, you know, how to listen to heart sounds and stuff like, I wouldn’t have been able to get like that, that full experience of exploring other careers in medicine. So I think I’ll look at it with that perspective.
James: Yeah, no, so it still was all very useful. Yeah, it’s a very positive outlook, and something I need to remind myself of instead of just saying like, “Oh, it’s all being wasted”.
Ashley: Yeah, yeah. I would agree. I guess I never really thought about that too much. But you know, like when you, when you start clinical rotations, like, maybe there will be something else that like, inspires you. And then it’ll open a door that you didn’t think could be open. So.
James: Absolutely. Yeah, well, we’ll see. I’ll circle back with you in eight months or so.
Ashley: Yeah, I would love to hear.
24:50 Why did you join APAMSA?
James: Yeah, and so that– I see like pathology and we’ve talked about your medical school career and the academic portion. But now I want to talk about the extracurricular stuff, and more specifically APAMSA. Let’s start with the beginning. Why did you even join APAMSA in the first place?
Ashley: You kind of touched on that a little bit in my intro. But you know, I didn’t find an Asian community that I, you know, could share. Or like peers. I didn’t find peers that I could really share my heritage with and cultural like nuances with until I got to college and I think it’s because Portland is not a super diverse city. And I did have Asian friends but I think like, my Asian-ness is something I only really appreciated with my family. And I think I never sought out to share that Asian-ness with my friends at that point. But then when I got to Cornell, like even my parents were like, “there’s like so many Asians here”. And they were super surprised about that. And I didn’t know what to expect, moving all the way to the other side of the country. But I actually found like a really large community of just like Asians and like I was actually able to speak Cantonese with with friends for the first time, outside of my family. And so I thought that was really cool. And I think that sort of unlocked something within me I’m like wow this is something that I didn’t realize I was missing but I really really like it. And so I came back to Portland and when I started med school I was like, I want to have that community again. I want to be able to have that community here in Portland. And also I guess I didn’t really interact too much with the Chinese community or the Asian community in Portland, and I thought it would be cool to serve that population here as well. Because I wasn’t really in touch with the community. And so that’s the first season why I joined like the OHSU chapter of APAMSA was to really find that community again and be able to do something with medicine with them. And then that was really fun. I really liked that, being able to have that community to lean on and depend on. But also to connect with outside of school. And then in terms of joining national board, OHSU had won the bid host National Conference. And National Conference directors aren’t elected they’re sort of like selected from the host school. And then so I had this opportunity to participate. And I was super nervous. I was like, you want me to like help run a national conference? That sounds crazy because I’m not really an event planner. I obviously had never planned an event to this scale before and I had a lot of doubts and insecurities and a big lack of confidence but my friends who were other national conference directors. They were like, you know, you should participate in this I think like you’d be a good addition to the team. I was like, okay, we’ll see. And so I became the National Conference Communications Director. And I had so I had so much fun doing that. I didn’t realize that, you know, using my brain like creatively and being like bit artsy. I’m like not a great artist but I do like doing some art. And being able to do that with the National Conference for APAMSA was actually really really fun. And I’m so glad that I had people to support me and give me that confidence boost where I couldn’t give to myself. So I’m super grateful for them pushing me to like get into this role and then you know by the end of the year I was like I want to keep doing more, I want to keep working on the national board, I want to keep working like artistically and creatively. And so I ran for social media director after the National Conference was over. And then, so, I kind of stayed on. And so that was super cool. And I’m really grateful that I have the opportunity to have this position because it’s super fun and I get to work on APAMSA, which, you know, has like the mission and the values that we all want to, that we all like are really behind.
James: Yeah, absolutely. I can definitely relate to that. Because I think like when people ask me like, why are you so passionate about this organization? I always immediately connect it back to my personal statement. And talking about I want to serve the community I’m a part of. And I feel like there’s no other organization that really does it like APAMSA.
Ashley: Agree.
31:05 APAMSA Core Memory
James: You know, and so looking back with this very like illustrious career in APAMSA is there one memory since your graduating right? Is there one memory that you’re going to be looking back at very fondly, like wow I did that you know with the rest of the National Board or like with your own efforts or however you want to answer it.
Ashley: Yeah, one core memory that will definitely always stay with me is on National Conference day. It was during the lunch period slash poster session period. All of my National Conference co-directors, we took group pictures in front of our photo booth area. And then I was like – everyone is out and about at that time. Everyone was gathered in the big atrium in the building so like lunch was set up there, the poster session was there. That’s sort of all the events that were going on at that time and so everyone was mingling about. And we were at the photo booth that was set up along the wall. And we’re like taking pictures and then as we’re taking pictures you can just see like the whole scene like everyone gathering, having fun, eating, talking to people about their posters and stuff. And I was like wow I’m so proud of us. And so proud of what were were able to do and to see a year’s worth of work culminate in one day. And to see people enjoy themselves and we’re also enjoying ourselves, yes there’s a little bit of stress, but it was like I felt so much pride in that moment. And like, I was almost tearing up. I was like, I can’t we’re taking pictures but like I felt like the tears I kind of like coming up because I was like just so proud of like what everyone was able to do and like we then took pictures with our committee members and stuff and yeah, I just felt like immense pride in that moment. And also just like I couldn’t believe that I was able to participate in something like this and to help bring something like this to life.
James: That is a really touching story. Are you attending the National Conference? This upcoming one?
Ashley: Yes! I bought my tickets and everything.
33:21 2023 National Conference Theme
James: And so for our listeners, the next APAMSA National Conference will be hosted at Duke University School of Medicine in North Carolina from March 7 to 9. 2025. Yeah. Hope to see you guys there. But, I actually wanted to ask you one more question about your guys’s National Conference, and it was a little bit ago, but how did you choose your theme? Renewal: Out of the Flames, Into the Future.
Ashley: Oo, that’s an interesting question. I was not the brain behind it. I was sort of the Yes-Woman, I was like this sounds great! It was our National Conference Finance Director, Hannah Moon. She’s a resident now! But yeah, she, I think she came up with this idea. Her and our, actually I think she was the main one behind it. Yeah. And I was like, it sounds great. I love it. And you know, the, my like comms director brain was going and then I was like, oh, out of the flames, a phoenix would be a great logo design and so that’s sort of where I ran with that. But I was inspired by her for the theme and then that’s sort of where our national conference logo came from.
35:07 Wishes for APAMSA’s Future
James: Gotcha. Yeah. And so on the topic of, you know, out of the flames into the future, now that your time, we cannot thank you enough for your time in APAMSA, but is there something that now that you’re graduating, moving forward onto residency soon enough. Is there something that you hope for, for APAMSA? Something you hope we do for the organization, some sort of change that you want to see, something related to the future of APAMSA, is what I’m asking
Ashley: That’s a great question. I think just like the growth of our organization. Like I think APAMSA offers so much to its members and like there’s so much support that APAMSA can give chapters to create, or host events, participate in health fairs, community screenings, and things like that. And I think those are super valuable experiences. And I would just love to make that available to like a lot of other chapters and so then they can like serve their communities in that way. I feel like APAMSA does a lot to serve the communities that all our chapters are in. And so just like seeing like the growth of our organization to more like more pre-health chapters because like there’s so many opportunities for mentorship. So I would love to see that. And just the growth of our organization so then, you know, we can inspire more students across the country, and then it can also just like serve those communities as well. So I’m like super excited to see that. Yeah.
James: Absolutely. I personally can’t wait as well to see APAMSA keep growing. And I’m sure like all of the hard work we as a national board have done this year will keep the momentum going for next year and so forth.
37:18 Community Impact Week 2025
Ashley: I’m excited for the event that you’re – that you’ve taken a big part in putting together. Your week of service.
James: Oh yes so for listeners let me make sure I get the date right, but what Ashley was referring to is Community Impact Week which happens from Sunday January 26th to Saturday February 1st, 2025. What she’s referring to specifically is that I wanted to create an event that sort of celebrated Lunar New Year through service, through philanthropy, through, you know, being there for the community. And so we’re, we invited every single medical school that is affiliated with APAMSA to volunteer during that week, to sort of show our presence in all of the local communities. Yeah. And so we’re going to be posting more about that as the days roll by. I’m sure by the time this episode is actually posted, it’ll be right around the corner. So I’m sure listeners will have a lot to see but yeah I’m very excited about that too. And I think on the topic of growth, um, in the topic of like how many members there are of APAMSA, like, I think the reason why I thought an event like this should occur is because like, there are over 180 chapters across nine regions of the United States. And I just felt like, even though we are all individual local chapters. It would be a nice opportunity for us to all come together in solidarity to do something for our AANHPI community. I think this really encompasses – also the importance of like, serving, like, of Lunar New Year, you know? It’s not just about celebration, you know, let’s get that good karma going right away.
Ashley: Yeah, yeah.
39:16 What Are You Looking Forward to in Your Medical Career?
James: Yeah, I’m very excited about that, but we have about one more month so that’s a little bit in the future. But I wanna talk about something a lot more in the future. And so with you graduating in 2025 and residency being right around the corner, there’s so much to look forward to in your career. You’re going to be a doctor in like less than six months, which is kind of wild.
Ashley: Oh gosh, I know. That’s crazy. My grandma was just telling me yesterday. She was like I’m going to start calling you doctor, and I was like oh my god. This is crazy
James: What is something you’re especially looking forward to in your medical career? As a doctor i guess.
Ashley: Um, I guess I from like a medical student standpoint right now. Something I’m looking forward to. It’s just like getting in to my career, like graduating residency and coming out. Most pathologists, I think, will do a fellowship as well. Like 90 something percent of people do a pathology fellowship so after fellowship I’m excited to just be like a competent pathology with the knowledge to be able to sign out cases independently, to be confident. I mean we’re going to be lifelong learners right? But we’re going to come out of training feeling like we can do things for real and not have to run things by someone. And of course there’s always like, you will come across things that are difficult or that you don’t know and will ask your peers. But I’m excited to do the work, to do the work and serve the people and to have the confidence to do that. I’m just like excited to get to that point. We’ve just been learning for so long, training for so long, I want to be the real deal. So that’s what I’m excited for at this point.
James: Absolutely. And I’m, I know I speak, I can speak for all of APAMSA and all of your friends and colleagues. We are looking forward to you, for you and that very bright future ahead of you.
Ashley: Thank you.
41:46 This or That? Questions
James: Yeah, absolutely. And as we come to a close for the podcast. We have two more segments to go through. If you guys, if you took a listen to Vic’s podcast episode, we like to do a quick rapid fire of This or That questions just so we can get to know you a little bit better. Because we know you’re a gamer and you like anime and a baker. But this is just quirky questions, you know A or B, really fast. Are you ready?
Ashley: Yes
James: City or beach
Ashley: City
James: Cats or dogs
Ashley: Dogs
James: Text or call
Ashley: Text
James: Black or white
Ashley: Black
James: Morning or night
Ashley: Night
James: Summer or winter
Ashley: Winter. I feel like I’m a holidays kind of girl, so I feel like that’s when all the fun things happen for me.
James: Fair enough. Breakfast or dinner
Ashley: Dinner? I do like brunch but I feel like dinner options are greater.
James: Mm. Would you rather have the power to be invisible or the power to read minds?
Ashley: Be invisible.
James: Would you rather have $100,000 to spend on yourself or have $1,000,000 that you can spend on others?
Ashley: $1,000,000 to spend on others. There was like this quote I heard that was like “why do I need something” or, “why do I need to have something that I only need to use tomorrow when someone could have that if they could use it today?” So I feel like that’s really stuck with me.
James: And finally as we are all medical students, would you rather retake STEP1 or retake the MCAT?
Ashley: This is probably controversial but I think I would take STEP1? It’s a longer exam, there’s so much more material that goes on behind it, but like, I feel like in didactics I was able to keep up with board studying and anki through didactics to the point where when I got to STEP1 like after doing practice questions and stuff I went into it feeling pretty chill. And I remember going into the MCAT feeling not chill at all. So I already have the potential to be chill going into STEP1 so I feel like I have the ability to get back there if I needed to.
James: Yeah, absolutely. And I don’t think that’s that outlandish of an answer. Unfortunately, since we’ve only asked this of two people, you and Vic, Vic said that her medical school didn’t require her to take the MCAT. So…
Ashley: Beautiful.
James: Yeah. I will keep you posted as we keep asking more and more guests of the pod which one is the more popular exam.
Ashley: I’m excited to keep listening.
45:14 Piece of Advice for Students
James: Well, in that case, that wraps up our This or That segment. We appreciate your candid honesty. To end all of our one-on-one series for White Coats and Rice, I always like to end it seeking out advice. So Ashley, what is one piece of advice you would like to offer someone in their medical school journey, whether they’re pre-med or someone who’s right in the middle of their didactics or rotations? You know, what is one piece of advice?
Ashley: I would say my piece of advice is to allow yourself to invest in the things that make you happy and fill your cup. I feel like it’s super important if you have hobbies that you really enjoy to really take the time to enjoy those hobbies and do them. I feel like it’s really important to have that outlet and something outside of school and the daily grind. But then in terms of like school related extracurriculars, I think it’s important for people to– like it’s ok to invest more time into an extracurricular that you really like and not as much into something that doesn’t fill your cup as much, that doesn’t inspire you and excite you. Like for example if you really like mentoring and tutoring and you don’t like doing research as much, I feel like it’s okay to spend more time doing tutoring and mentoring. You don’t have to do that research if you don’t want to. I feel like it’s easy to fall into the trap as a student who is reaching for that next step, that next milestone, it’s easy to feel pressure to do everything under the sun to try to get yourself to that next point. And ya, just give yourself grace and allow yourself to do the things you like to do because there’s a lot of required things that we have to do in school, whether it’s– you know you have to do a didactics block or you have to do a core rotation and you’re not going to like everything. It’s impossible to like everything that you’re exposed to in medical school. If you do, then great but I feel like that’s not the case for most people. So because there are all these requirements and the schedule is really tough and you’re always working, I feel like it’s important when you do those extracurriculars to be doing something that still can inspire you and can keep your love for medicine alive and keep pushing you towards that next step. And it’s totally possible to build your CV and to do something you like at the same time have that overlap and be the same thing. I think that’s something that I’ve sort of worked on and I know– I’m sure other people feel the same way. So just know that, I think it’s ok to invest your time into something that you like to do.
James: That was sweet. In any case, thank you, Ashley. It has been such a pleasure getting to know you better. We hope that you keep your cup filled as the rigors of residency are around the corner. We’re so appreciate of you taking the time out of your day to share your story with all of us. To all our listeners we hope you enjoyed this episode as much as we did. Don’t forget to tune in next time and regardless of what time you’re listening to this episode, happy holidays and take care!